Big Otter sanctuary Petition

[SRT8]

Hey everyone a few guys have been looking into trying to get a sanctuary set up myself being one of them and we are making some head way now we want to show how much support there is in the angling community this will be at the falls in tillsonburg and possibly part of the river during closed times to help with enforcement so guys can't say "We are just sucker fishing "with a $1000 custom float rod and reel .So if you fish for steelhead in the river or the lake please sign the petition and get your buddies to do the same Thanks in advance for your support.

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/bocsanctuary/

I would like to thank Denali custom rods, The Rod Gloveand Live Eye Jigs for their support

 

[wildeye rainbow]

Super Idea Shawn!

Thanks for getting it started.

WR

 

[Fish Bones]

Hey SRT8 I agree with your concerns of conservation, however if you are thinking a sanctuary is going to do anything about the guys taking the trout out of there,out of season your mistaken. A perfect example of how these type of rules dont work is to look at the multi million dollar waste of money known as the gun registry. On paper these idea's seem great but there effects are not stopping anything. You say you have a problem with guys with $1000 float reels fishing for anything other then trout? Its just a fishing pole no matter how you slice it! Its any anglers right to use whichever type of pole they prefer,maybe we should just take a moment to consider this isnt nazi Germany or north Korea and we all have the right to play within the rules that our government has in place for us. I hope with your little petition you guys can consider a proposition to have an extended fall season for trout upto the Tillsonburg dam, similar to that of Bayham county and Big Creek upto Quance dam? Like I have said I totally agree with conserving nature, however completely cosing a beautiful river playground isnt the solution and wont stop the ones who have no regard for conservation. I think its a dangerous game to play always monkey-ing around with the rules, and I personally am sick of the strangle hold on my freedom becoming tighter and tighter around our necks by the day!! Be careful what you wish for....... FB8D

 

[SRT8]

I have no problem with the guy with a $1000 float rod ond reel as I have one that's pretty close to that myself,however I do have a problem with that guys using that $1000 float rod to poach steelhead on the river I have called my home river my hole life and I have to disagree with the fall extended season unless its a no retention season because as much fun as it wouls be to fish into december in town its like shooting fish in a barrel and there would be 2 fish headed up the path by every meat hunter in southern Ontario this section of river is already closed for trout and in the fall there's nothing else but carp around and I've never caught a carp that wasn't snagged on roe so if your a ethical angler this change won't effect anything other than allowing the CO's to fine anyone they find fishing the area period no more I'm sucker fishing excuses I can't understand how any angler could have a issue with improving a fishery but you are entitled to you opinion.

I would like to thank Denali custom rods, The Rod Gloveand Live Eye Jigs for their support

 

[quinner01]

quote:
Originally posted by Fish Bones

Hey SRT8 I agree with your concerns of conservation, however if you are thinking a sanctuary is going to do anything about the guys taking the trout out of there,out of season your mistaken. A perfect example of how these type of rules dont work is to look at the multi million dollar waste of money known as the gun registry. On paper these idea's seem great but there effects are not stopping anything. You say you have a problem with guys with $1000 float reels fishing for anything other then trout? Its just a fishing pole no matter how you slice it! Its any anglers right to use whichever type of pole they prefer,maybe we should just take a moment to consider this isnt nazi Germany or north Korea and we all have the right to play within the rules that our government has in place for us. I hope with your little petition you guys can consider a proposition to have an extended fall season for trout upto the Tillsonburg dam, similar to that of Bayham county and Big Creek upto Quance dam? Like I have said I totally agree with conserving nature, however completely cosing a beautiful river playground isnt the solution and wont stop the ones who have no regard for conservation. I think its a dangerous game to play always monkey-ing around with the rules, and I personally am sick of the strangle hold on my freedom becoming tighter and tighter around our necks by the day!! Be careful what you wish for....... FB8D

 

[quinner01]

Hit enter too many times on the last post, but Fishbones:

a) The only way Big Creek could have an extended fall season is if, it was a sanctuary the rest of the closed season, which it is, you cant fish it for suckers or anything, try and you'll get an easy fine. There is also a fish ladder, allowing fish migration, this is not the case on the Otter.
$100 float gear guys was just a generaliztion, theres lots of anglers down there fishing with spinning rods and big roe bags out of season. I have also seen people tossing big rocks/boulders onto spawing fish, I am down there a few times a week, and see it all. If you think the actions by these people are perfectly fine, then I guess youre entitled to your opinion, and if you dont think these things happen, then youre clueless. Why take advantage of a fishery that gets no support, no stocking, nothing. Its easy for most people to play within the rules, but theres always some who dont. Pretty easy to follow a sanctuary, get caught fishing and there are no excuses.
And completely closing a beautiful river playground? The part in question isnt even a km long. You have 50km of the same river to fish for your suckers or whatever you choose...

CO's cant be everywhere, they are understaffed big time, but making it a sanctuary will 100% forsure mean less people fishing, guaranteed. Will it stop everyone? No, but then when the CO's are there, its easier for them. I'm not starting an argument here, I just think some of your points arent clearly thought out.

 

[fish_for_life]

Gotta say I agree with fishbones on this one. I for one would never want to close off the river to someone that may honestly be fishing for something other than trout. I know lots of guys that fish suckers and other species. Is it fair to shut them off completely to cut out the handful that aren't abiding by the regs. Careful what you wish for is right.
If you want to stop the poachers use your hotline and maybe fight for more funding for the CO's. Cause if they aren't around enough then how can they fine people for being in a sanctuary!
You'll still have the same problem in the end.

 

[Fish Bones]

Quinner1 you clearly misunderstood my point! What im saying is that put whatever rules in place you like BUT the fact of the matter is.....The idiots who destroy the area, poach fish and have no general concern for the river those people DO NOT FOLLOW OR CARE FOR OUR SET OF RULES!!! With that all cleared up for you, the only ones who will end up suffering is all the guys and gals who actually take the time and effort to understand the ecosystem. Im all for protection for our fragile enviroment but creating a santuary will not help one bit.....SRT 8 im all for protecting the river so please do not try to twist up what im saying! There are always going to be jackasses out there, you can make all the laws you want but were all stuck with them.....

 

[SRT8]

If you guys don't think that a sanctuary will help the river then you haven't been watching the fishing go down hill fast like I have for the past 15-20 years there used to be a great salmon fishery it's been completely wiped out the sanctuary I want to see put in place is only at the dam some guys want to see it from the dam to white bridge I personally think that that is to much but if we can get a sanctuary in place at the falls and things improve than there may be a opporunity in the future for a extended season which I would be all for IF the river rebounds(right now I wouldn't support it ) there are people fishing directly under the falls almost daily weeks before season opens and every one says they are sucker fishing which is 90% BS some people do fish for them but there are way better spots to do so than under the water falls thats loaded with steelhead I'm not trying to start a big argument I am trying to improve my home river that is getting raped every year if you don't want a sanctuary that voice your opinion when the time comes I really can't tell ya anything else .

I would like to thank Denali custom rods, The Rod Gloveand Live Eye Jigs for their support

 

[angler]

Just for the sake of argument.
While I support the intention here and in the discussion on fish off the reds 'yellowfever' does have a point in his comments re the fishing being legal.
It seems to me there is a bit of irony here in the "concern" for people doing things we are not in favour of;yet, I was struck by the number of the same people talking about the smallmouth they catch while fishing for pike. You cannot convince me that every one of these bass were not on nests and that hundreds of fry were not lost while the 6 lb's were reeled in?

 

[Stick]

quote:
Originally posted by angler

It seems to me there is a bit of irony here in the "concern" for people doing things we are not in favour of;yet, I was struck by the number of the same people talking about the smallmouth they catch while fishing for pike. You cannot convince me that every one of these bass were not on nests and that hundreds of fry were not lost while the 6 lb's were reeled in?



The irony to me is if the area where these big smallies were caught was a sanctuary already then these incidentally hooked fish would not have been disturbed and allowed to spawn in peace. There is give and take when it comes to imposed sanctuaries. This is not a perfect world unfortunately. That is what I'm reading into the main idea of this thread and the subsequent posts.

My thoughts on the original post are coming. I just can't type that much that fast. Be careful what you wish for!
Stick

"Rivers are living things, sometimes swollen and discoloured, other times thin and anaemic. Spend enough time around a particular river, you learn to read its moods, like a spouse reads a partner."

Gord Ellis ONTARIO OUT OF DOORS

 

[jordy]

I think the sanctuary idea is a great idea. It works well on big creek and could do the same on the otter. I would love to see an extended fall seaon up to the simcoe street bridge to compensate the fisherman. Getting rid of the dam at black bridge would be the best solution to this problem, as then the fish wouldn't have their migration halted. In my opinion, a sanctuaty from black bridge to the simcoe street bridge in would be a good idea. That way, sucker fisherman would still have lots of productive water to fish, while still protecting the trout that are halted at the dam and the first few holes below.

 

[quinner01]

Just to clarify, the entire river would not be a sanctuary... At most, only from Black bridge to White bridge (simcoe street), or as little as just the dam, which should be in place, like any other dam.

Agree or disagree with the idea, please dont use the "takes away from sucker fisherman" as an excuse. The Big Otter is how long? 50km maybe? And making 1km or less of the river a sanctuary for half the year does not take away from someones fishing opportunites. And there are several spots to target suckers, or carp.

 

[Josh Roelofsen]

quote:
Originally posted by quinner01

Just to clarify, the entire river would not be a sanctuary... At most, only from Black bridge to White bridge (simcoe street), or as little as just the dam, which should be in place, like any other dam.

Agree or disagree with the idea, please dont use the "takes away from sucker fisherman" as an excuse. The Big Otter is how long? 50km maybe? And making 1km or less of the river a sanctuary for half the year does not take away from someones fishing opportunites. And there are several spots to target suckers, or carp.

Exactly, there's better sucker water downtstream of that section anyway. Anyone who disagrees with you Quinn has obviously not been down there to watch the steelhead being raped, or they're a one of the poachers that wants to see it stay open.......

And sanctuary or not next year down there, just give me a call buddy if you see any poachers down there! I'll deal them on my own if I have too! I refuse to put up with that sh!t!

Josh

 

[quinner01]

quote:
Originally posted by Fish Bones

Hey SRT8 I agree with your concerns of conservation, however if you are thinking a sanctuary is going to do anything about the guys taking the trout out of there,out of season your mistaken. A perfect example of how these type of rules dont work is to look at the multi million dollar waste of money known as the gun registry. On paper these idea's seem great but there effects are not stopping anything. You say you have a problem with guys with $1000 float reels fishing for anything other then trout? Its just a fishing pole no matter how you slice it! Its any anglers right to use whichever type of pole they prefer,maybe we should just take a moment to consider this isnt nazi Germany or north Korea and we all have the right to play within the rules that our government has in place for us. I hope with your little petition you guys can consider a proposition to have an extended fall season for trout upto the Tillsonburg dam, similar to that of Bayham county and Big Creek upto Quance dam? Like I have said I totally agree with conserving nature, however completely cosing a beautiful river playground isnt the solution and wont stop the ones who have no regard for conservation. I think its a dangerous game to play always monkey-ing around with the rules, and I personally am sick of the strangle hold on my freedom becoming tighter and tighter around our necks by the day!! Be careful what you wish for....... FB8D



I literally laughed out loud after reading this nonsense, I do not even know where to start. You told Srt8 that a sanctuary will do nothing to reduce poaching and fishing activity at the bottom of a barrier that rainbow trout stack up below in large numbers and then compared it to the gun registry? Seriously? How about the countless fish sanctuaries all over ontario and the world that protect sensitive and desirable fisheries. If you did even a little research you would know fish sanctuaries are a very effective conservation tool. Second, are you seriously comparing implementing a 50m-100m sanctuary on a river that runs miles and miles from north of tillsonburg-port burwell to nazi germany and north korea? Give your head a shake. A 50m-100m sanctuary below this dam will have only positive impacts on the entire big otter creek fishery from the headwaters to the lake and for anyone who fishes anywhere in between. Who said anything about completely closing a beautiful river playground? This is a gross exaggeration. A 50-100m sanctuary is closing only an extremely minimal area on the big otter creek system while making it a healthier, more diverse fishery and increasing fishing opportunities to fishermen throughout the big otter watershed. It is a win win situation, no? Comparing this to communist countries and strangle holds on your freedom becoming tighter and tighter every day is laughable and makes it hard to take you seriously. I couldn't help but reply to this ignorance because no one should take you seriously.

 

[SRT8]

OK guys enough is enough If you support the petition sign it if you don't then don't. this is why it is so hard to get any improvements done to our fisheries .Couple things I want to respond to here,

1- Comparing incedental bass catches on LAKE ERIE to people purposely poaching steelhead is Nonsence PLEASE don't waste our time with this argument (Bass is open right now state side )

2-I started this thread to get support for a petition not have people bickering back and forth so PLEASE if you are just going to try to bring down what we are trying to do then don't bother posting it will save us all a lot of headaches .

3- This bickering is exactly why the dam on the lynne isn't going anywhere and will be fixed instead of repaired(Which I do not support it needs to come down)but the Non fishers see us all arguing and push there agenda's through because we are to busy fighting among our selves .

Finally PLEASE guys no matter whats been said just let this one go to bed and if you support it continue to and if you don't your time will come to oppose it in the proper venue because if this is getting close to being passed I will be posting for the supporters on here so you will know when meetings and what not are happening this posturing and attacking each other needs to stop we are all grown men/women not school kids .(This is directed at everyone myself included so don't take it personally)
Every one has a opinion but thats not what I was asking for I really wish this thread didn't go down this road [xx(]

I would like to thank Denali custom rods, The Rod Gloveand Live Eye Jigs for their support

 

[green head]

i don't trout fish and i can kind of see both sides points on this one. the only thing is fish bone has a good point !! i like to take my kids out fishing a river when the weather gets nice it would suck if i could not take them out. because some feel that i don't have the right to fish because of some bad apples. fish bone is also right if i am a poacher. nothing is going to stop me unless i get caught. and lets face it we need more co`s to in force the rules so getting caught is unlikely. one thing they could try is . restrict the use of roe. if caught using roe= fine. would work for every one. guys who like to fish like myself would still like to use the river just as much as you do!!!!!!!

 

[SRT8]

Green head there would still be miles and miles of river to fish were talking about 75' at the falls and at the most a km to the white bridge which just below is the best sucker spot on the whole river IMO like I said sign or don't that's all I'm asking.

I would like to thank Denali custom rods, The Rod Gloveand Live Eye Jigs for their support

 

[green head]

i was just trying say what i feel would maybe make both sides of the fence happy. not trying to get you all bent out of shape. maybe we should sign a petition on more co`s to enforce the rules we already have.

 

[SRT8]

I'm not bent out of shape I just don't want this thread to turn into a battle thats why I politely asked people to not reply to the thread any longer it looks bad on all of us whether you support it or not .

I would like to thank Denali custom rods, The Rod Glove and Live Eye Jigs for their support