Long Point Old Boys Club -Secrets Revealled!

S

singlemalt

Well-Known Member
In another thread the subject of the mysterious "Old Boys Club" has come up again as it does from time to time on "68". I have some time this morning and felt compelled to address the issue. It is certainly a strange organization. From what I call tell like a lot of secret societies it has no annual dues, issues no membership cards and produces no membership list. The members recognize each other through secret signals, odd greetings and unique forms of dress (Max-4 and Mossy Oak Duck Blind are rumoured to be a sign). Another strange aspect is that when the term OBC is used, especially on this forum, it is in the form of an insult or term of derision. Yet as far as I can tell everyone wants to be a member and all those who are part of it seem proud to be recognized as one of the OBC?

Now let me come clean and say I personally have been accused of being a member of the OBC on more than one occasion. Not sure if I really am. There may be different levels of membership and I just have not reached a high enough level to be given all the Club secrets.

In this post I intend to tell all I know about the organization and how to get in. First, let me say there is no formal application process. As far as I can tell like Hell's Angels you need to be invited in by a member. There are a few exceptions who seem to have inherited membership because their father and even grandfathers were members. One thing I can say for sure is you only get in by personal contact. There is no internet application process.

I am not the sure about the process for others but I can tell you how I got in. I started hunting the Long Point area about 25 years ago because I heard so much about it in hunting circles. I came to the Unit once or twice but was intimidated by the size of the marsh, the complexity of the system and the scary gruff "Old Boys" I saw there each trip. I started hunting the Hahn Marsh as it was much simpler and less intimidating. However, I came down in the very dark of a late November night with my canoe on top of the car only to find the launch area frozen solid and no sign of open water. With my only option driving home and not hunting I reluctantly drove over to the line-up at the Unit and parked in line. When I went to the office I observed all the Old Boys exchange their secret greetings and passing information on to each other in code and by mysterious hand gestures. When it came to my turn I had no idea what to do but pick something which looked close enough to the launch to paddle and slipped out into the cold windy dark. In those days there used to be breakfast served from 4:00am at the little restaurant on the Point and as I was nervous about trying to find my blind in the dark I stopped in for something to eat. When I entered |I was horrified to see all the seats were full except for one at the table with three of the most grizzled, gruff and tough looking old silver-back members of the OBC. I almost left but I summoned my courage and asked them if i could join them for breakfast. They immediately pulled out a chair and started chatting, asking where I was from and what blind I picked. When I told them they asked if I had ever been there before I said no and they told me how to find it, where to hide my canoe, how to set the decoys and where to watch. I went out did exactly what they said and had a limit by early afternoon. I was thrilled!

I went back the next Saturday and when I saw one of the OBC who had helped me I went right over to him, shook his hand, and told him about my hunt and thanked him for the advice. He seemed pleased to have helped and that began my process of entry into the OBC. I started coming down every Saturday, did a lot of re-rents, and met more and more OB. Eventually I ended up hunting with one of them on a pretty regular basis (I think because he had no dog and liked mine).

I started to show up for blind day and other work parties and then eventually was invited to put my name up for one of the LPWA Directors positions. I was honoured, although back in those days there were around 25 Directors and we never seemed to be able to decide anything.

It was around this time that I was first referred to by someone as a member of the OBC. At first I was shocked, but I drove home with a warm feeling of pride in my chest.

My advice and lesson to those who are not members is come to the Unit. I have been skunked a hundred times but I have never felt I wasted a day there. Be open, be friendly, ask for help and if you don't get it try again. Offer thanks for the help, when it is given, as the information passed on to you has often been gained only by many years of experience and observation and should not be taken for granted. Also watch and learn for yourself, most things really worth doing in life don't come easy and waterfowling is one of those activities.

Certainly approach me and ask. I have never refused help to someone who asked me personally for advice in a polite way. I am very proud to say I have also introduced several people to the marsh who now hunt it regularly. A couple of these guys may now even be members of the OBC!

See you in the office!

Signed,

Name withheld to protect the secrecy of the organization.
 
Well said old boy. Thanks for expressing in words what keeps our OBC alive and well. I am sure like you most of our initiation in has been engraved in the mind of the Long Point Duck Hunter for ever. I am proud to be part of what the tradition is about.

Name also withheld but can be found dressed like the marsh and smelling like a muskrat with a grin from ear to ear.
 
It could be convincingly argued that the entire LPWA is an OBC. It requires dues and membership. If you are not part of this club, you don't get a say on the management of a public resource. If someone doesn't like the flavour of the LPWA, they don't become members, and they don't get a vote in the management of a public space. If the LPWA allows non-members who are residents of the province to vote on issues at the AGM, then I will believe that they are not an OBC.
(How's that for a use of acronyms/ some additional controversy? haha)
 
DDG, although I don't think I know you I have observed from your other posts that you are well informed and understand how things work down at the Unit and have valuable things to say. However, I am concerned your post could confuse others.

You know the LPWA does not manage the Waterfowl Unit. It is run by the MNR, Long Point Provincial Park and the OFAH. The LPWA is a volunteer organization which offers suggestions, advice, labour and money (over $50,000 in the last decade) to ensure that the Unit is managed well and has the resources to improve the marsh and operate the Unit at no expense to the taxpayers. You are right it is a "public resource" which really means we only use it with the Government's permission, not a situation I consider safe.

This being the case I think it is vitally important that we stand together as hunters to ensure it survives and we continue to have access. When I first started hunting many decades ago I used to hunt at, and hear about, a bunch of public places like Darlington, PresQuille, Rock Point, Binbrook, Taquania and Indian Point. I don't hear about them any more. Is there still access to the "Public Resources" any more? Is it any good? Even the Hahn, which I used to love, could clearly use some effective advocacy and money. How many hunter's used it in the last few years?

The places I continue to hear about in a positive way are Rondeau, Hullet and Long Point all of which I know have very active users associations who work to protect the right of hunters to have access and work to improve the habitat and the opportunities.

If you don't like the "flavour of the LPWA" then you have the option of writing the people who really run the Unit, the MNR, the Park or the OFAH. However, unless you have a lot of friends who feel the same I doubt you will get much of a hearing. I would suggest the most effective way to promote change would be to join the LPWA and participate. (its only 20 bucks if you are already a OFAH member, or maybe you don't like their flavour either?). It is only a group of a couple of hundred members and anyone with good ideas and the tenacity to voice them and stick with it has a pretty good chance of success.

As for the relationship between the LPWA and the OBC that is a very complex one. Yes, I would guess that it is true that the bulk of the members of the OBC are also members of the LPWA. On the other hand I think some of the LPWA's harshest critics are also members of the OBC (though as far as I know even the most vocal of these critics still maintain membership in both organizations.)

The LPWA has a clear role to protect and improve the hunting opportunities for all who hunt the Unit. The OBC's role is less clear. It seems to be mostly about pissing off people who do most of their hunting on the internet and the constant game of trying to identify who is a member and who is not.

I know I am a proud member of the LPWA, that only cost $20. I hope I am also deserve the status of OBC member, that had to be earned.
 
I know I am a proud member of the LPWA, that only cost $20. I hope I am also deserve the status of OBC member, that had to be earned.you shouldn't have said that???
 
Good points, Single Malt (but of course anyone only needs a few well-connected friends to change things up, even within provincially-owned lands ;) ). I understand that the LPWA only makes recommendations to the province; I also understand that there are likely "strata" of the OBC, with some memberships more valued than others; but what I have experienced is some questionable behaviour by some very knowledgeable and quality guys that turns a lot of people off.

The LPWA does good things for the Crown marsh and the Hahn is a great comparative example. The Hahn has some restrictive rules with no publicly-inclusive management structure; no interested individuals to donate valuable time and money because of the lack of inclusion (willful or not). The LPWA is an organization that I am generally supportive of (for most of the reasons that you point out), but as many experience, there is something that makes portions of the LPWA seem less than inclusive; to be honest, I've been thinking about what it might be, but I'm not quite sure. What I do see in your example with the Hahn is, the more people you can include meaningfully (make them feel like they are accepted and can have an impact), the more people and money you're going to have available to manage the marsh- in a way that I do think is most appropriate.

It is a public space, but as I see, if you don't fit into the role that the OBC is willing to give you, your ideas aren't just democratically turned down, you're run the f*ck out of town and you'll need some thick skin or a thick head to come back again (and some people do importantly seem to have at least one of those attributes!). Of course, there's no way to stop the membership from acting this way if they choose to, but it does stop people from buying memberships and it does keep people experiencing an OBC.

And yes, I'm also not interested in being an OFAH member- although I do donate time to both the OFAH and the LPWA- both groups do some great things that I will contribute to, but both groups have, from time to time, acted in a way that I'm not comfortable with. And if there are a couple hundred members, than myself and my family have put in more time and labour than a majority of members but remain ineligible to vote on recommendations -> maybe there could be a co-op program where individuals who donate $20 of time per year (say, an hour or more) are eligible to vote without membership.

Having to ask the government's permission is never safe; but the controlled hunting of the Crown marsh is most likely the government's most cost-effective option. It can continue to charge us whatever fees it can imagine, it prevents the fighting and enforcement issues that we see in the surrounding "free for all" areas, and it prevents what would be the inevitable enforcement and legislative issues that would arise if they restricted hunting in what really is legally understood as a common resource space (Trespass to Property Act, Public Lands Act, Beds of Navigable Waters Act). When you consider the ease of access and proximity to other recreational uses, maintaining the Unit really is in the government's best interest, and not because of the ducks.
 
OK DDG, I really don't see much in your last posting I disagree with. I guess it's just a matter of perspective. I have worked for 30+ years in sales and fundraising. Jobs which require an optimistic point of view. If you don't believe that good things happen when people can get together and discuss stuff it would be hard to get up and go to work in the morning.

Some people work better in groups, some are more comfortable working alone. Its just my experience that those working within groups get more accomplished, even if it is not 100% of what they wanted. By bending somewhat to accommodate the group you significantly increase your opportunity to get things done with the power of numbers.
 
I agree with you Single Malt, and you are one of the best on the Board in my opinion. I am always willing to work with the LPWA because I think it is a great option in conjunction with the other opportunities at the Bay. Lately, the LPWA has been changing more positively, with a few hiccups, and has always been a well-intentioned hard-working group, in my opinion. Certianly, some people will never join the association because that's just the kind of people they are; I personally never feel too excluded when I'm actually using the Unit, but some people seem to vocally experience this and I have no reason to believe they're being deceptive. There also isn't a need to accomodate everyone's opinion, I've had my fair share of opinions shotdown in life and if the process is fair, I'm ok with it.

My original post was intentionally controversial, but in reality, I'm not sure that I could even suggest many improvements for the LPWA. Most of the people are a lot closer to being professional hunters than they are professional policy-makers or decision-makers; I realize that and it's difficulties and know that they're doing the best job they can.
 
OK DDG,thank you for the kind comments. I am content to agree to disagree (if we really disagreed about anything anyway). It seems you and I have taken over a posting like a private conversation I started hoping to involve many. Let's hope others will give us their point of view.

It feels like we are slipping into that sad part of the year when we talk about duck hunting more than we do it.
 
awesome post singlemalt!
I think that the main part of being a member of the OBC is actually interacting with people at the unit and talking amongst one another, not posting a question on a thread on this site and expect people to jump through hoops to answer it
if you think it's hard getting answers now.....then wait till next year when Fred's not there running it!(he says it's for sure this time :()
out of everyone that we've met down at the unit since my brother and I have hunted there (8 years now), he's always helped us out the most(not saying that others haven't too)
if you haven't taken the time and get to know Fred, I guess it's your loss!
hopefully next weekend we can squeeze 1 more hunt in for this year, see you there!:)

When times are tough,
and flocks are small,
take your time,
and kill 'em all!
 
Cam,

I am always happy to jump into these conversations.

Most years I have been a member of the LPWA. I did not join this year although not for any particular reason other than I didn't get around to it. I did not hunt the unit this year either and if I had come down to LP I would have paid my $20. In the past I have joined in on several work parties, donated money to the corn fund, bought raffle tickets, bid on silent auction items, been to several meetings and attended dinners. In general I would say I have been a good member when I was a member. The last couple of years I have been going to Hullett, Lake St. Clair and Rondeau. I can honestly say that I miss the unit but I just don't have enough days to hunt anymore.

On the issue of the OBC I don't question it and I won't debate it. I am definitely not a member. The issue is not that there is or isn't an OBC at the LPWA; the issue is the perception that there is one and what it means.

There are a couple of ways to address this. One is to consistently do all the things that you say brought you back. Sadly not everyone has the same experience you did but I would bet most do. I don't think that is the main concern of most folks who bring up the OBC.

The other main issue that pops up is the unwillingness to adopt change. This inevitably leads to accusations that the OBC won't stay with the times. While I don't want to open old wounds this has been a contentious issue over and over again. I certainly don't advocate change for its own sake but I will say that transparent processes, respect, civil conversation and proper discussion of the issues is necessary in any organization. It will help keep the organization relevant and help protect against the loss of hunting opportunity that others call progress.

Both OFAH and LPWA have done a ton of great work in the past and will I hope continue to do so in the future. I don't always agree with everything they do but that is just me. Member participation is the key to both organizations being relevant. It is critical that these great organizations foster an environment where folks feel like they are always part of something important and their participation matters. Everyone should feel like they are welcome to join the club.



Paul
 
This was the first year I had a trailer down at the unit. It was the best season I have ever had. I didn't shoot as many ducks as I have in the past, but had more fun. The Friday night "information" sessions around the campfire were the highlight of my weekend and I felt anyone would have been welcome. Advice was given freely and all questions answered. The more time you put into hunting at the LPWMU the more you'll get out of it, meet great people and get a few more ducks A crazy idea I know in these times of instant gradification.
Mike Kunkel
 
WoW
It can be frustrating to read the posts on this site, I quess that is why i read it less and less . As someone who has been fortunate enough to have hunted in Loisiana ,North Dakota , Maine ,Saskatchewan, Alberta , Quebec and closer to home at Hullet , Rondeau ,Holiday Beach , Tiny Marsh, The Hahn as well as try to maitain the rights to a few farms near home . I can tell you this without a doubt that most people have no idea what the have at Long Point and the LPWU . I have hunted places that have more birds have seen the skies full of birds in almost umimaginable numbers i have had Mallards come into a field 3000 at a time i have had snows come into a spread in such numbers that you can hardly hear your gun go off i have shot a lake in Manitoba were we were the only guys hunting ducks and even on a sunny afternooon with no wind the Cans would come into a handful of decoys 30 at a time there red heads shining in the sun .But i have never had as much fun at any of these places as i have had shooting the unit .I have made great friends there over the years and it takes alot to make me miss a friday night at the fire ! The unit is what you make of it if you want a certain blind you can get it you just have to invest the time . you dont have to worry about someone setting up on the other end of the pond or someone being in your spot when you get there .If you are new to hunting the unit come around on friday nights everyone is always welcome and you will have no problem getting advice and having any questions answered .One thing i have learned over the years of being a director is that you can never make everyone happy and some of the complaints get to be a bit much .We have a couple of guys on the board that are some of the best waterfowl hunters you will find anywhere and know alot about ducks and how to run a marsh but please remember we dont run the marsh do we !!! If there is someone who thinks they can do a better job than me then step forward in April and i will step aside and you can have my spot . Like Single malt said i too am a memeber of the OBC and i also feel i have earned it and am proud of it !! But it does not get me anything at all no special privleges . I take my holidays in the fall and spend time in the line up to get the blinds i want i take off mondays and spend my sundays in the line up . I pay to keep my trailer there just like everyone else does or can if they choose to I pay my sustaining membership and my park pass iam permitted to be in the top 3 five times just like everyone else . I have no more say then anyone else has on how things get run in the unit . It would be nice to see more threads about duck shooting and less complaining about the greatest place to hunt waterfowl in North America !!!!!Like i said earlier i hope people start to really realize what a great thing we have with the Waterfowl Unit .
Ps Mike it was great having you and your gang around the fire this year it really was alot of fun !!Wow that was a long post for me !

Glenn Hanson
LPWA Director
Shooter of Mallards only after Thanksgiving
and member of the OBC

PSS please dont correct my spelling

" Thats 12 already ? count them again Larry "
 
What a bunch Of BS, started hunting in LP when I was 16 and now I am 42, if you don't like it, it is simple go somewhere else to hunt, yes there is rules, please admit they do get broken from time to time, had several occasion over my time there.

That is why I hunt mitchell's bay now, and yes the guys there have rules too, don't mind starting all over again :D

Please guys it is public, like Glenn said before he would step aside, and let someone else do all the BS that goes with the job.

Team work men

Still a member Chris Smith. and yes will be back someday to hunt again.
 
Hello Guys,

This thread was rather thought provoking.

I started hunting waterfowl in 1978 and my first hunt was at the LPWMU ... Blind # 42. I will never forget that first hunt.

My second hunt was at Presqu'le and I will never forget that hunt either. Incidentally both the Darligton and Presqu'ile waterfowl hunts are doing fine. However a few years back (near the turn of the century) there was a move by the Ontario Federation of Naturalists (OFN) to terminate waterfowl hunting at Presqu'ile Provincial Park.

I became actively involved in the review process for the new Presqu'ile Provincial Park Management Plan that would affect the park for the next twenty five years. I eventually wrote a rather lengthy letter outlining my concerns and some options for the MNR to consider. I was later told by a representative of the OFAH that my letter (which they had received) had a significant impact on the MNR final decision.

We all have something to contribute to the LPWA and to the LPWMU ... either in experience, financial contribution, knowledge, labour (sweat equity) or time.

If anyone doubts what Glenn Hanson has stated about the LPWMU then they should read the article "Top Ten Diver Destinations of North America" that was published in Wildfowl Magazine several years ago ... Long Point was one of them.

I eventually decided to move from Mississauga to Port Rowan because of Long Point rather than to Brighton because of Presqu'ile and the "divers" there.

People do not appreciate what they have until they lose it.

Something to think about.

Jerome Katchin, D.V.M.
 
Cam

Thanks for starting a wonderful and thought inspiring thread.

Funny thing about Long Point in general is that most aspects of life here are dictated by the OBC mentality. The Unit is just one of those things that We love about the Point. The model has worked for a very long time now. Many people have come and gone...some have stayed but I think to a person.... watching the thousands of birds lifting into the sunrise it inspires awe in anyone that has seen it.

The OBC is nothing new. It predates everything about Long Point. The original OBC owned and protected the Point jellously for decades before anyone ever settled it. Hell....the now members of this club still are such traditionalist that they eat their lunches out of pails that were made in 1866. Now that is a degree of "don't change things" that few would understand.

I am hoping that this sense of tradition that the people that have chosen to live...visit...explore the Long Point area enjoy. It was part of what has attracted Me to live here. If it wasn't for this sense of tradition and protection there would be little about Long Point left to enjoy. There would be boat channels and casino's all the way to the light house.

I have suggested change....craved it early, thinking that it was important. But really.....nothing is important as the images that are as old as history. The birds...the marsh....the people who enjoy it.

Just a word of caution for all. We are surrounded by those who do not agree with the past time we enjoy. There is definately strength in numbers. What ever you do in life be ambassadors to the waterfowling life style. One stroke of the pen and it could be gone forever. Remember...the current model for the Unit is just one of many that includes no waterfowling at all.

Gar
 
After reading this earlier today and spending the rest of the day considering of or not I should or not post a reply lead me to saying sure why not.

At 51 yrs of age, I've spent most of the past 36 years Dedicated to this passion of waterfowling. I've won Many duck and goose calling titles, guided for too many years and gunned all across Canada and the US.. Hell I even lost a marriage to this passion, guess she felt the loved chasing birds more than being home with her.. I often wonder how she's doing. I've put my time in to this sport and still have a hard time getting to sleep the night before thinking about the next days blinding snow storm and locked wings approaching the blocks. I left the marshes and waters of Long Point bay for over 20 yrs and returned a few years ago to savour its beauty.. Long Point Bay has etched many wonderful memories in my mind that I'm so grateful for. Now back to my original reply.

First off Cam you should be a politician because you sure have a way to tell the people what you think they want to hear but others are to afraid to say anything because they can see through your bs and I'm one of the few that will stand up and be honest about it to your face while others will sit back and talk and curse about this whole situation with the LPWA around their own private campfires. I feel that many people that frequent the park turn the cheek and deal with the situation because ultimately they either live with it or leave as many have and don't come back. From what I know the LPWA is there because it is a Public Marsh and Not a Private Marsh. Many outsiders feel that the board make their own rules and bend them as they see fit to suit themselves. For example, the meeting over the vote for a Lottery.... That was cut and dried before the people ever voted. Outsiders feel that the Lottery didnt suit the OBC , so it didn't happen. And please don't try and deny it because it was also made public about Mr Frietags action trying to sway select and possible influential voters and then when one of those honest men came forth with the true your little plan went for a big dump. You were all in on it and you know it!

Then what does Arnie need to do to help put the scandal to bed, he resigns, which was the right thing to do because of his dishonesty.. That wasn't good enough for you guys though... Granted, he has been around along time and I'm certain he's been a huge help and a great friend to all of you. He's part of the click and I understand that.. But then what came next (in my opinion) he should've Never been reinstated after pulling something underhanded as that but there he sits on the board. And I'll say it again the lottery was cut and dried before it ever went to vote because the OBC didn't want it ! Forget the average working man that loves to hunt that marsh and Deserves a fair pick yet Never gets it because of rules made for ones the power that be.

Certain rules and conditions apply such as staying with your vehicle while in the line up how is it that certain people have their vehicle parked there waiting for a good pick the next morning yet they are at home sleeping in their own bed And have a blind eye turned to that while the poor working slob sleeps in his truck overnight because he doesn't live close or owns a trailer, he just loves to hunt and will make that sacrafice to pull a good pick the rules are made to be broken for a select few but the sheriffs go looking for the owner of a vacant vehicle if they don't know it and the hammer will fall.

Or how about blinds be rented to certain individuals because they have that power to do so...

I can go on but i feel I've got or at least hope I've got my point across as to why many good people who have dedicated their lives to the sport of waterfowling that we all love but see the flaws in the LPWA to ongoingly complain or leave and never return because of their perception of the OBC.

Please understand that I for one am Very Grateful for all the hard work and dedication the people on the board of the LPWA has given and continue to do for our sport and marsh and I also hope that my honesty will not have people looking the other way as I walk towards them because that was Not my reason for this reply..

I do feel that nothing's changed regarding who killing all the birds down there in over 20 yrs and you all know that the Public of The Public Marsh want change.. The general Public would like the chance to get the prime picks and even if most new comers jad first pick they likely arent going to know what blinds to take on certain winds anyways ut they all deserve thst chance....as Rondeau has opted for the fair way. Sorry to be blatantly honest but nothing lasts forever and it might be long overdue for a Fair change.

So enough of your psycho babble bs of why many refer to you and the rest as the OBC

Thank you and respectfully, Ernie .

Men are from mars, women from Visa
 
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